Friday, January 3, 2014

Turning Over An Old Leaf

Fewer than just 50 weeks ago, after Gannon's 66-64 loss at West Chester, I wrote a post about Gannon getting burned by TMT -- Too Many Turnovers. TMT doomed the Knights again on their eastern PA swing this year in losses at East Stroudsburg, 75-60, and to that same West Chester club, 73-72.

I won't say here exactly how many turnovers the Knights committed in the two games combined. Instead, I will list the word "Turnover" for each turnover to give a visual of just how many that is. If you read each word aloud, I guarantee you will be screaming, sobbing, and/or pulling your hair out before you get to the end. That's if you haven't already pulled out all your hair this season. Here goes:

Turnover. Turnover. Turnover. Turnover. Turnover. Turnover. Turnover. Turnover. Turnover. Turnover. Turnover. Turnover. Turnover. Turnover. Turnover. Turnover. Turnover. Turnover. Turnover. Turnover. Turnover. Turnover. Turnover. Turnover. Turnover. Turnover. Turnover. Turnover. Turnover. Turnover. Turnover. Turnover. Turnover. Turnover. Turnover. Turnover. Turnover. Turnover. Turnover. Turnover. Turnover. Turnover. Turnover. Turnover. Turnover. Turnover. Turnover. Turnover. Turnover. Turnover. Turnover.

The Knights were averaging 15 turnovers a game heading into the new year but surpassed that total by 12 at ESU and by 9 at WCU, the last one leading to a game-winning basket with 5 seconds left. Oh, how the thrill of victory can quickly become the agony of defeat!

If that information isn't depressing enough, here's one more stat for you: the now 6-7 Knights have already matched last season's loss total, a season they didn't qualify for the NCAA tournament. Can we really be just 4 days into the new year and have our only avenue to make the NCAAs be winning the PSAC tourney?

84 comments:

  1. Here's hoping the men can start 2014 on a positive note with a win.

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  2. if this game continues as it has started... we have a chance at competing/winning... but we're going to get smashed on the boards!!

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. i would like to retract my comment now... we're up in rebounds by 2 and down by 19... ugh

      Delete
    2. i really regret my earlier comment re: rebounds
      4:30 left
      Rebounds GU 34 - 19 ESU
      Turnovers GU 26 - 11 ESU

      Delete
    3. Not going to win with 27 TO's leading to 30 points ... Not going to win period.

      Delete
    4. That's all they scored was 30 points off the TOs?????

      Delete
  3. Sean Ammucci just said Gannon was in a zone then he said "No I was mistaken". No kidding!

    Gannon down 32-15 with 5 minutes left i the first half.

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  4. 18 TOs with 15:30 left... absolutely awful!

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  5. stats say Jabs newby played <1 min and had a block?

    did he actually play or do they just have wrong player listed?

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  6. Newby is not on the final stats sheet. Must have been a mistake.

    This Gannon team is amazing. How can you outrebound your opponent 41-23 and get smoked in the final score?

    Let's go a little deeper: Gannon shot 20/50 from the field and 17/23 from the line -- missing 36 shots, but getting 18 offensive rebounds. This means that on all shots, Gannon either made the shot or got the offensive rebound 75.3% of the time (20 + 17 + 18) / (50 + 23).

    Stroud missed 39 shots, but got the offensive rebound only eight times for a total 63.5% efficiency (27 + 12 + 8) / (59 + 15). The moral of the story is that when GU gets shot off, we're much more likely to score or get the offensive rebound. So what's the problem?

    There's that pesky detail called a "turnover." Gannon 27, Stroud 13. When you give your opponent 14 more possessions, you're going not going to win, no matter how much you dominate the other statistics.

    Sadly, the only statistic that matters right now is 6-6. I'm with Jim on the fact that a 14-12 season is looming large. A win tomorrow and a split of a tough road trip certainly will help matters.

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  7. Gannon managed to lose both a road game AND a home game today. Here's the info from the Gannon sports info department:

    The basketball doubleheader with Cheney University on Wednesday, Jan. 8 will be played at Penn State Behrend's Junker Center. Tip times remain the same: the women's game at 5:30 p.m. and the men's game at 7:30 p.m. Admission will be free, but seating will be on a first-come, first-served basis; the Junker Center has only one category of seats. This will apply to all patrons, including Gannon season ticket holders.

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    Replies
    1. They've been saying it would be at Behrend since the fire happened so not a shocker. Better than the alternative of playing a "home" game vs cheyney AT cheyney. Or having to play a home game at MAC or Boro Barnhouse.

      Delete
  8. We only get 400 people when we play at the Audi. Maybe 200 when we play this game at the Junker Center. First come - first served! Really!

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    Replies
    1. Wouldn't be surprised if we got more than usual. Behrend students are usually huge supporters and I'm sure there will be a slew for a free game d2 game.

      Delete
    2. I kinda sort wish there was a line to bet on at the Downs for the attendence at this game. The Shippensburg Edinboro game may be where I head on Wed night instead.

      Delete
    3. The smallest crowd for a 7:30 home contest has been 643. No game has been below 426. I predict at least 500 and wouldn't be surprised if the crowd was over 750 or even 1,000.

      Delete
    4. You guys might be right about the attendance. The #2 ranked girls (13-0) are playing first and maybe the Behrend students will stay for the guys game.

      Delete
  9. Talley only played 14 mins... Coach decision? Injury?

    Also I never directly question a coaches decision but I was a little boggled when Gannon got the game close late that emmitt (4a 1to) was replaced by CJ Oldham (1a 4to) to accompany Blazek (1a 6to) and raph (0a 6to). Between 3 guys on court at same time you have 2a and 16 to. Just a dangerous situation IMO.

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    Replies
    1. He goes with his gut, remember

      Delete
    2. That and "just try to create" on the final shot!

      And most of all remember "Our system works". Plus "we don't want to be known as an offensive team".

      Well guess what. His team is offensive and so is he.

      Delete
  10. P S A C 2013/14 Att
    MEN WOMEN
    TOT G AVE TOT G AVE
    1 Indiana 8,572 6 1,429 1 Indiana 2,801 5 560
    2 Gannon 7,014 8 877 2 Gannon 2,739 5 548
    3 E Stroud 2,975 6 496 3 S R U 1,454 5 291

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  11. 17 TO's vs. 3 assists for GU in the first half. It does not seem like this team is getting better, it feels like it is imploding...

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  12. That is the story of the Men's Season. Down by 18...come back to have a 3 point lead with 18 seconds left, foul before an inbound, 2 WCU FT and Gannon turns the ball over after inbounding the ball, WCU scores to take the lead and GU loses. Unbelievable.

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  13. If you listened to the after game intvw Coach Rielly's voice said it all. He was really shaken
    and didn't know what to say. I don't blame him. It was a devastating loss.
    Now they got bounce back (if they can) against Cheyney at PS-Erie. Yikes! & Ugh!!

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  14. Did he say "Our system works?" That's what he says when he wins. 6 wins two games into the January schedule. Yikes and Ugh! When is the last time Gannon had a 6-7 record? How many previous Gannon coaches had a 6-7 record? That would be real interesting to know if somebody could look that up.

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  15. Death, Taxes and Blazek taking the last shot....

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    Replies
    1. This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

      Delete
    2. Jim Busbee: I deleted your comment because it violated our guideline of criticizing a player. Not only do these guys put in a ton of work, it takes a lot of courage to do what they do under pressure. If you made every shot you ever played when you were on a scholarship, maybe I'd let you criticize them in public. Then again, if you did play college ball, you'd know better than to say what you did. Thank you for participating in the blog, but in the future please go easy on the kids. Thank you.

      Delete
    3. I didn't criticize him. I merely stated a fact.

      Delete
    4. Roddy: This will probably be the only time this will happen, but in Busbee's defense.. he really didn't slander the player as much as the original posting by Jeremy did. "Death, Taxes and (name of player) taking the last shot..." -- Busbee said "and missing it.." Now in all fairness... which of those two statements is a more direct hit towards the player?

      Delete
    5. For the record, I never stated that nor do I agree.

      Delete
    6. While I neither agree or disagree with a lot of statements on the blog, I do feel bloggers do have a right to say what they're thinking. I also believe that Roddy has the right to control.
      That said, individual expression should not be hampered.
      In my opinion and everyone has one, we need not be over protective of any ball player. They are grown men and soon will face much tougher crits in the real world of the rat race.
      A little kick in the butt will sometimes give you the boost needed.
      Don't think anyone was out of line so far.

      Delete
  16. A couple observations from this road trip. Size is not as important as some think at this level. Gannon used six players 6'6" or taller while Stroudsburg only had one who played ten minutes and West Chester had two who were 6'6". Gannon out rebounded both teams in fact have a twelve rebound advantage per game but are currently 6 & 7. It appears you need a lot more than height and rebounding to have a winning team.

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  17. wait, what ???? 51 turnovers the last two games.....sounds about average to me

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  18. This years team might have as much or more talent than any other of Reilly's teams. How can they possibly be 6-7 after 13 games. That is horrible. The Cheney game is BIG. Lose that one and watch Reilly lose total control of the team. In my opinion, the Cheney game is a make it or break it game.

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    Replies
    1. I feel the same way. How can they possibly be lossing this bad. Maybe they should try and make more two point shouts than three.

      Delete
  19. I was at a kid's birthday party and checking the live stats on my phone periodically. I got a little less social in the closing minutes. What turned out to be a sure loss got very interesting at the end. It was 72-69 with 18 seconds left. Next thing I knew it was 73-72 final. I almost yelled at my phone "WE LOST??? HOW DID THAT HAPPEN??"

    I obviously wasn't at the game or didn't listen, but you have to be playing magnificently to fight back from 18 down on the road against a pretty good team like West Chester. Only to throw it all away in the last 18 seconds. What a waste. Sigh.

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  20. At this point I think we are looking at around a .500 record or so for the end of the year. 2 games against IUP still, one with SRU, 2 with Edinboro & 1 against Mercyhurst among other remaining games. I truly think it is going to be a struggle to finish above .500. The effort is there, the results just aren't.

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  21. As a point of clarification to attendance prediction on Wednesday - PSU Behrend is not in session (like all other state schools & Gannon/Mercyhurst). There's no way that students are attending those games from Behrend, since they're not actually on campus. Also, Behrend (8-2) had 279 people in attendance at their last game, when school was in session. There's just no way.

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  22. When you take pride in rebounds and defense instead of wins and losses this is what you get. No more excuses... just dump the guy and move on. That is the only way to see the team heading back toward the top.

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  23. WHY NOT SET A GOAL FOR EACH PLAYER TO PUT 10 POINTS ON THE BOARD. LETS DO A LITTLE BIT MORE OFFENSE. DEFENSE WIN GAMES, SO DOES OFFENSE.

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  24. You have the talent. Put the puzzle together. Lets Go Gannon. Rise-Up!!!!!!

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  25. Just read where Edinboro beat Cheney. Cheney is now 2-11. How can we lose this one?

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  26. Jim: Who are you REALLY rooting for??

    If Gannon were to go on a roll (hey, let's just win one at a time!!) a lot of your points would be invalidated.

    Ah.....the beauty of blogs!!!

    As the schedule moves into the West side of the PSAC, while we might need some help, we also can make a serious run. I think this team will compete hard every night out.

    (Speaking of Cheney, I think one of their main players last year transferred to IUP and is making enormous contributions.....)

    ReplyDelete
  27. #453: I am rooting for Gannon just as I have done for years and years. However, I am tired of watching Reilly's same old .. same old. I advocate recruiting freshman and building the program from the ground floor up. Bring in a JC or 2 to compliment the rest of the players.

    This can be done; it has been done. Other D-2 programs do it and GU has done it in the past. It can and does work. The girls team has built one of the best D2 programs in the country doing it this way.

    We need a coach with an open mind that can recruit and build this program into the powerhouse it once was. Reilly has had more than enough time to do that and he has failed. Every time he has a good season he should be able to use that success and bring in better recruits to keep the program strong. But that doesn't seem to happen.

    Reilly went 12-15 and 9-17 in 2005/06 and 2006/07. The first time since 1955/56 and 1956/57 (50 years) that we've had back-to-back losing seasons. The next 2 years he brought in some JC transfers and Knight and Goldcamp fell into his lap. Great seasons; the kind Gannon has been know for. We had 2 consecutive appearances in the post season. Most coaches would have been able to use that success to bring in some very good recruits to further advance the program. Not Reilly. The next 2 seasons saw him go 13-15 (his 3rd losing season in 5 years), 15-11 (.577) and 14-12 (.538); both of which are right around the .600 winning percentage we've discussed before on this blog. Not a whole lot to brag about. Last season Reilly went 22-7 and just missed the post season. Another good year.

    Under Reilly we've seen history repeat itself. We're 6-7 and if we win the rest of our regular season games , the best our record can be is 19-7. What are the chances of us winning 13 in a row? If it happens, I'll be that happiest guy in the world. Will it happen? That's another thing; highly unlikely. History points to something more like 14-12 or 15-11; right around the .600 marker.

    This is our 70th year of college basketball. In our first 69 years we have a winning percentage of .641 and in 6 of our first 8 years we were below .500.

    Since the 1961 season (that is when Gannon made a commitment to turn the mens program around) to the end of last season GU winning percentage is .678; which includes Reilly's .621 winning percentage. Without Reilly's record Gannon (from 1961 - 2004/05 season) has a winning percentage of .716. Apply the .716 percentage to this season and you get 18-8 or 19-7. Friends, that is where we need to be.

    In his first 8 years here Reilly has had 20+ win seasons only 3 times or 37.5%. Pre-Reilly (1961 - 2004/05) we had 20+ wins 22 times in 42 years or 52.5%.

    The numbers do not lie. Reilly is just not living up to Gannon standards over the last 70 and especially the last 50 years.

    What do the professional and other college teams do when the coaches don't live up to established standards? They get rid of the head coach and all of the assistants.

    That's exactly what we need at Gannon. Get rid of Reilly and all of his assistants and lets start rebuilding this once proud program. And the sooner the better.

    By the way can anyone out there help me build my website www.dumpreilly.com? I need some help but I'm ready to get it going.

    ReplyDelete
  28. Jim: You make some valid statistical points, but, my opinion is that you lose all credibility to say we dump the coaches and assistants.

    This team can make a SERIOUS run for the remainder of the season. They play every team to the max in terms of effort. As of late, some very brutal losses, to be sure. But, to even mention firing people when this team puts forth maximum effort every game is something I simply do not agree with.

    ......"The sooner the better"......coming on the heels of a 22-7 season. Wow!

    Good luck with your website, though!!!

    ReplyDelete
  29. In response to a couple posts:

    * Why I deleted Busbee's critical post of a player. Yes, Jeremy wrote, "Death, taxes and (name of player) taking the last shot ..." which implies you can count on Gannon implementing that strategy in every close game. But when Busbee added "and missing it!", he's stating you can count on that player to miss that shot every time, which is a mean-spirited cheap shot.

    * Busbee: In regards to your post about “get rid of Reilly and all of his assistants” and your “Dump Reilly” website. John Reilly is a good man. He’s not perfect, but he has never embarrassed the Gannon community and none of his players have either. During his time at Gannon, he has helped many young men achieve their degree and has helped them become better people. I’m one of them. His assistants are good people, too, who are trying their best and make a positive impact on Erie. Disagreeing with strategy is fine but to publicly call for anyone to be dismissed from the team is not appropriate.

    So blog rules moving forward (so I can enjoy this site):
    * No mean-spirited criticisms of individual players. Example of acceptable criticism: “C.J. Oldham should have passed the ball to the open man instead of shooting a 35-foot hook shot.”
    * No calling for anyone – coach or player – to be dismissed from the program.

    You’ll need to find a way to enjoy the blog by following these rules because I can’t enjoy the blog without them.

    Thank you.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. My post of "... and missing it" is as much of a fact as "Death, taxes and Blazek taking the last shot". It was not meant to be mean spirited, simply a statement of fact.

      I agree with you that Reilly is a good man. He's proven time and again that he is not perfect but then none of us are perfect either. I'm not suggesting that he has embarrassed the GU community although some of his players might be guilty of that; we'll never know due to privacy rules (Agee).

      What I am suggesting is that Gannon can no longer afford to have Reilly and his staff continue to take the basketball program where we are obviously headed. We need to be building this program the way it was built in the past. Bring in solid FRESHMAN players and keep them for 4 years. Look at Blazek. He is a solid player and the best part is that he'll be back again next year. Death, taxes and Blazek (back at guard again next year).

      We must also ask why so many of the players that Reilly brings in here end up leaving during the season or after their first year. One year we lost all 5 of the freshman recruits plus 2 transfers. These players should have been the foundation for the program to be built on. We're still feeling the effects of that loss. And what about the D1 transfer Isaac Reid who lasted all of 1 game? What happens to guys like Algeron Torrence who basically won last years Edinboro game then disappeared on the bench? What about the year that Reilly brought that D1 transfer from West Point at the beginning of the second semester? He was supposed to be the second coming of Christ. The same season he brought in some guy from Columbus who had prior D1 experience at Montana or Idaho or who knows where. What kind of plan is that?

      Why do all of these players come here and leave? Is it Reilly and the staff? Is it their character? Do they not like it at Gannon? Is it the winters in Erie? What is it? I'll bet that Reilly has lost more players than all of the other coaches in the last 50 years combined.

      I simply put forth this: Is this what you want out of the GU men's basketball program? If your answer is YES then Reilly is your man. If the answer is NO then ________________ (I'm not allowed to say it). You fill in the blank.

      Delete
  30. Jim B-
    Happen to agree with your position regarding how the team should be built-with underclassmen augmented by a jc when needed. I am interested in your reaction to A year or two of, say 6-19 seasons which would be likely in the transition. Willing to tolerate that?

    ReplyDelete
  31. We have no other choice. We don't have to go 6-19 for 2 seasons. Bring in solid freshman, a couple of JC transfers and mix in the returning players from this years team then provide excellent offensive and defensive coaching and lets see what happens.

    One advantage we'll have is the PSAC. We know that there are only a few really good teams in the conference so the first year maybe be we'll be 12-14 (probably not too much worse than what we'll see from Reilly anyway) then the second year and 3rd year well be back to the .650 to .750 type of basketball we've known in the past.

    CHANGE is good. Change for the sake of change is not. But change that will bring in new ideas, new coaches, new players and new attitudes will create excitement and bring back the fans who no longer attend the games because of their discontent with the present coach and his style of play.

    It is time for a change in the men's basketball at GU. Most everyone knows it but only a few will admit it and even fewer will state it. Get on board fans because the train is leaving the station.

    ReplyDelete
  32. I personally HAVE been embarrassed by the Gannon b-ball program, not by the losses...and not specifically by Coach Reilly and the other coaches who all seem like great guys, but by the unprecedented losses/transfers of student athletes.

    How many student athletes DID NOT get their degree because of this? And in 9 years, we've had 1 four year player?

    This is embarrassing to me...as a season ticket holder, as a Gannon alum and as a supporter of GU athletics...

    Although there were not mass defections last year, so maybe things will get better.

    ReplyDelete
  33. We need to start the program in a different direction. We need to be proud of the program not embarrassed. Do we have any other choice?

    We need to fill the stands with the rabid fans we've known in the past. I don't want to hear about the students not showing up and the season ticket holders getting older and dying off. Go back to the 2008-09 season when we were 30-4 and hosted the Atlantic Regional. We filled the place for the playoff games. Articles in the paper talked about the fan support and how it looked like the days of Chapman had returned. Give us a consistent solid winning program every year (not the 3 out of 8 that Reilly has given us) and the fans will come back.

    I spoke with a friend who has had 2 season tickets for 45 years. He has only attended 4 games in the last 5 years because of his dissatisfaction with Reilly's program. He has 3 friends who each have had 2 season tickets for 43 years. 2 of the friends have not been to a game this year and 3 each of the past 2 seasons. The third friend attends the women's games and leaves before the men. They only reason these season ticket holders purchase their tickets year after year is in hopes of a new coach starting a renewed program back to superiority.

    Lets not wait until it is too late. Lets get started now.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Those are called fair weather fans. I go to as many games as I can. Am I happy with the way this season has gone? No. Am I thrilled with the overall past 8 years? No. Do I think we could've been better certain years? Yes. Would I like to see Coach Reilly use a Zone D here and there? Yes. Am I going to not attend games because of these? NO. They can go 0 for 8 years and I'll still go. I'd rather be watching GU Men's Basketball than BayHawks (pro sports are a joke), Otters (like going to games, but not a hockey fan), Erie Express or whatever they may be called now (reference BayHawks), Erie Illusion (nothing against women playing football, but not my cup of tea) or any HS game. And I am definitely not going to go watch the HersheySquirts College (they'll always be college) Lakers or the Edinboro Fitting Skirts.

      I love college basketball and I love Gannon! 0-23, 23-0, 12-11, 11-12... I'm going if I can!

      Delete
  34. Jim, I certainly understand your desire to not have this blog be a place to whip student athletes. Particularly since the kids (key word “kids”) are not at fault and I believe the group that the men’s team has assembled is talented and would succeed at most other PSAC schools.

    I do however disagree with your desire to apply arbitrary rules to coaches and other school employees. This seems like a socialistic attitude. If what you want is a “happy place” to rah, rah in the face of a disaster then I will not be back to this site.

    This will be my last post and visit, so let me make one last observation: As a business owner I realize, and other business owners can confirm, that removing an employee that is not producing, is the toughest part of being a manager. That person may be the nicest person, a smart person and a good “company” person. Still, in a small business, and Gannon is a small business, your commitment as a manager or owner is to the success of the business and that is for not only your own concern but for the sake of the other employees and the customers, the people that pay the bills.

    I have learned over the years to make sure to give all employees the information to know if, in my eyes, they are doing great, average, poor or if they are a liability to the firm. I have found out that most employees already know what category they fall in and are prepared for the consequence.

    I realize that the Gannon mission is that of higher education. I believe that that is their main purpose. The sports programs are window dressing. I believe that even though Gannon sports programs have excelled in the past that it is obvious that the administration does not use sports as a draw to the university anymore.

    I truly believe that they should make this clear to the public by declaring for Division 3 status. They can save the cost of scholarships and the public and fans would clearly get the message.

    As a summary to the “relieving the duties of a good person that is a failing employee”: I found that many times that employee will go to another environment and flourish. Keeping them in a bad situation is not good to the business nor is it good for the employee.

    ReplyDelete
  35. Haven't missed a home game in the last 7 yrs.
    Here's what I'm hearing around the floor. Gannon Sports admin doesn't give a flip if you do or do not attend games as long as you keep paying $175 for you season ticket.
    Around the area.
    Bayhawks 3rd row 24games $66
    West Chester season tkts Century club chairbacks with hospitality $100
    IUP floor seats chair backs season, $100.
    Okay D1
    Canisius Family pack 2A + 2C season $125.
    RMU chairbacks $120
    St Bonnies Row 9 $120 season.
    Edinboro seniors all sports free.
    With the tight money and a so so product. is it any wonder why crowds are down. Some blame the competition. Maybe they're right. The BHawks entertain even if they are loosing and cheaper for a family if you aren't buying drinks.
    The GU games have gotten so bland. No pep band. Half the time the cheerleaders aren't there.
    You hear funny things when you've been there a long time.
    Some of those grumblers are leaving after the women's games.

    ReplyDelete
  36. something needs to be done.

    John Reilly is Gannon's Jason Garrett.

    ReplyDelete
  37. (I thought Jim was going to work on his new website.)

    All this recent nonsense regarding last season's PSAC (West) Coach of the Year. (Jimmy Roddy: Can you clarify if this is a peer related vote, please??). Amazing group of fans, really.

    One thing I'll note: Prior to his playing in a Gannon uniform, I was big on the transfer in of Robert Wilson. Looking back, he didn't quite SCORE like I thought he could, but, he was a tough, tough player in terms of boxing out, getting a loose ball, or, making a big rebound in traffic.

    Extenuating circumstances prevented him from playing this year. He is missed, no doubt. My guess is that his not playing this year due to his (career enhancing) decision is a 3 or 4 game swing for this team this season.

    Big games remain. Every one of them, in fact. I'm confident this team will finish the year on a strong note.



    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. IF IF IF
      IF is not an excuse for this programs lack of success.
      It stinks to call for people to be fired because your talking about their livelihood. But seriously someone has gotta go.

      Delete
    2. You are absolutely correct that "It stinks to call for people to be fired because you're talking about their livelihood". But they all know in advance that they either produce or they get fired. What about a salesman who works on commission? They know before they take the job that if they don't sell anything they don't get paid and if they don't eventually quit they get fired. That's life. Produce or you're done.

      As far as #453 goes IF he wasn't Reilly's friend he would be calling for the same changes we are.

      Delete
  38. It was only a matter of time until 453 started making excuses- 3 or 4 game swing bc of no Robert Wilson, hahaha. Clearly you are personally close with the coaching staff but your defense of them is getting laughable.

    Gannon's new motto: 'At Least We Haven't Embarrased Ourselves.' What a great standard to hold the school to, we're really aiming high.

    I honestly just feel really bad for these groups of good players who are worked to their limit then have their hopes of success torpedoed by a repetitively faulty strategy.

    ReplyDelete
  39. Here are 3 questions for you, 453, and Jim:

    1) IF Gannon doesn't finish strong, what would you think?
    2) What is the measuring stick of a bad coach in your mind?
    3) What is the measure of a bad season? a good season?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Are your 3 questions for Jim Roddy or Jim Busbee?

      Delete
    2. Roddy, but you're welcome to join :)

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  40. Jim: I could not agree more that criticizing players is not the right thing to do. As you watch them, they are playing hard and I am sure they do not want to lose. Yet when you print the word TURNOVER fifty one times that could be interpreted as criticizing the players because they are making the turnovers not the coaches. If you are talking about not singling out players maybe John should read your blog. After the Stroudsburg game when Sean Amicucci remarked what a good game Thomas-Edwards played John told him he was looking at the performance as a sports writer. He then proceeded to tear down Thomas-Edwards playing on the radio. This is something John got in a lot of trouble with the fans in the past. As far as criticizing the coaching staff, they are being paid to do a good job. When they don't then they have to take the heat that comes with it. I keep hearing that we old timers are living in the past and maybe we are but as Jim Busbee said give them a product and the fans will turn out. Sure Erie fans are fair weather fans. Just look at the attendance for the Otter's games between this year and last year. Another thing we need is a coach who has a high public profile and makes the fans feel like they are part of the team. Maybe this isn't part of John's make up but if you are going to fill the Hammermill this is what the fans expect.
    As Section B said the current administration does not seem to be putting any emphasis on sports. When pressed about the sports program Dr. Taylor said he could not understand why people were getting upset we are only a Division ll program. It's not like we are Division l. A agree with Section B , a university is first and foremost a place of education and the answer could be go to Division lll and apply the freed up resources for education endeavors.

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  41. Realistically I am looking at this as follows: This team still have 6 games against either IUP (2), SRU (1), Edinboro (2), and Mercyhurst (1). This team, if they play like they are capable of could potentially win 5 out of these 6. At the same time, if the teams plays like they have at times, they could lose 5 or even all 6 games. I think for this year the team is going to be middle of the road. As fans is this what we want? No. It's always more fun when your team is in the thick of the NCAA hunt. That being said, at fans that's support this team in a positive manner. The players are busting their butt out there. Whether we agree/disagree with the coaching, that is another subject. Let's support and cheer on the players, they are trying as hard as they can out there. I feel like this whole thing is groundhog day again.

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  42. A big part of the season remains in front of this team.

    I (wrongly, so far) figured at this point in the season, perhaps Wilson's departure would have been absorbed by contributions from the new players, and, the rest of the team as a whole.

    Not making excuses, but, them's the facts. He's gone. I'm looking ahead towards a strong finish to the season, starting tomorrow evening.

    Not so fast Jim, on me calling for anyone to be fired halfway through this season, or, any season for that matter. There is a TON of basketball to be played.

    How's the website coming?


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  43. No one ever suggested that any of us are not rooting for the players. Those of us who are campaigning for a coaching change probably cheer for the players as much or more than any of the fans at the games. Actually cheering the players on to a victory actually works against us since a good season will insure the return of Reilly. Don't get us wrong. We are FANS first. We want a change because we believe another coach can deliver a better, more exciting brand of basketball that will bring even more wins and post season appearances.

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  44. I get it, Jim. My point all along with all these darned close games is that we are CLOSE enough already without all this chatter about replacing coaches and staff. Something will click soon, for the positive, for this team. The entire team and staff is a "blue collar" bunch that isn't afraid to grind it out with anyone. I think there is a little of that characteristic in all of us here in Erie.

    As far as "exciting", tell us exactly what you mean there: More dunks?? Behind the back passes?? Blowout wins?? (I would like some of them too, we all would!!) Toilet paper from the stands?? Pep band??? (I touched on that last year, to no avail), A specially-made theme song played on local radio?? Donuts?? Gumby??

    I think we can all agree that what we need is a win. Let's get one tomorrow evening.



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    1. #453 do you remember the team that went 30-4 and was in the Elite 8? That was an exciting team. Fast breaks, 3-point shots, driving to the basket, taking charges; being down 10 points and going on a 22-0 run in a matter of a few minutes. This team is so boring and predictable that it almost puts you to sleep. I'm surprised that people don't show up at games in their pajamas.

      The opposing coaches know everything Gannon is going to do. Yes they play great defense but start counting how many times they pass the ball on offense and when the shot clock hits 10 they start to look for the shot. One game I counted 7 times in their first 10 possessions that the first shot came with less than 6 seconds on the shot clock. They missed on 5 of the 7 shots and the other 2 were shot clock violations.

      Maybe just maybe if they were allowed to take more shots sooner they might score more points. Taking shots sooner might also reduce the number of turnovers. Taking more shots might score more points and win more games.

      If Reilly is still here next year maybe he should evaluate his assistants and bring in an experienced OFFENSIVE coach for a change.

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  45. 1. Can we stop calling the players "kids?" It's the Gannon "Men's" Basketball Team. See the GU website. It's not the Gannon Kids Basketball Team or even the Gannon Boys Basketball Team. 2. The administration gave the coach a three year extension so calling for his ouster is a moot point. Unfortunatelhy, that leaves us precious little to comment on since criticizing the men is also off limits. 3. What the coach has done to the men's program is an embarrassment to us all. 4. There are millions of good people in the world. I didn't know that being a good person was the only surviving qualification for being the Gannon men's baskeball coach. 5. What happened to the Media Guide. It used to be on the GU website. Where did it go?

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  46. Sorry, Jim Busbee. I strongly disagree with your assertion that bringing primarily freshmen into the program could somehow result in a 12-14 record, even in the PSAC. Look at Lock Haven. Seem to have a decent coach now with a good connection to Philly kids(noted hoops hotbed) and he is just now getting them to respectability in his third year. Not sure anyone could do better here. Something we don't like to consider is the distance from cities like Pgh and Philly make it more difficult to get the best players from urban areas to come here. Also, the Erie weather isn't helping either.

    I don't feel like looking up Cleve Wright's record his first couple years, but I seem to remember a couple lean years right out of the gate before success began. Few turned up the heat on him because expectations for the Women's Team were low. Doubtful that fans of the Men would be that patient. They weren't back in Reilly's second year.

    I guess the answer to my question about the 6-19 season is a "no" then? I think it will be necessary to build the team from the ground up with frosh and I'd be OK with it, but I know the majority of GU fans wouldn't be.

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  47. I don't have time this minute to look up Slocum's record the first few years but I know he wasn't left much by Dukiet and he brought a very good player from Geneva. I know he didn't have a losing season during his tenure here.

    Plus Gannon was a member of the GLIAC when Jerry was here and as we all know that league was far superior to the PSAC.

    Get the right coach and staff who can recruit and I bet we can escape those 6-19 years that you think will come.

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  48. 453 keeps bringing up these close games, CLOSE losses. Well I was on a very informative website called statsheet.com/mbb/coaches/. That site breaks down the coaching records for all current coaches and historical records as well. There was one stat in there that caught my eye- close games. It lists that coaches winning percentage in games decided by six points or less. Check out a few of these percentages:
    - Coach K: .550
    - Boeheim: .637
    - Calhoun: .598
    - Knight: .556
    - Rupp: .616
    - Sutton: .533
    - Mark Few: .663
    - Roy Williams: .551
    - Calipari: .557
    - Self: .564
    - Matta: .551

    I then looked at Coach John Reilly's stats from his Gannon years. His teams have gone 30-38 in games decided by six points or less. That's a winning percentage of .441. That percentage is clearly much lower than all of those respected and successful coaches above.
    Successful coaches find ways to win close ball games. Those are the wins that propel a team into the playoffs and beyond. Instead, Gannon regularly has its sails deflated with close losses. Losing is not entirely on the coaches but then logic says it can't entirely be on the players as well. But this coaching staff clearly takes no responsibility, running the same failed strategy time and again.
    As an interesting note, the two successful years under this regime, saw Gannon go 5-4 in close games. To me that shows that the Goldcamp era teams simply blew out their opponents by large margins due to their superior ability, not coaching.
    These stats prove that the successful coaches find ways to put their team into the position to win close games.

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  49. Wouldn't love to see some sort of statistics and analysis about a coaches time management?

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  50. To add my comment about the Goldcamp era- there were relatively fewer close games in those years, meaning that those teams' success came from blowing away teams early.

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  51. Slocum not only brought a Hall of Fame player in Nesmith with him but wasn't another HOF player in Moyer waiting when he got here? That's a pretty good foundation in a coach's first year. Add in a couple jc's (price?) and that's a good team. Not a shot at Slocum but a good explanation of why he was so good out of the box. Reilly brought Truskauskus (hardly Nesmith) and got hired in mid-May. Challenging to say the least. Not defending Reilly, but the circumstances were not the same as Slocum's. Not a good comparison.

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    1. My comparison with Slocum was not with Reilly but with a new coach for next season should the administration ever come to their senses and make a change. A new coach next season would have a decent foundation to build upon. That was my point.

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  52. Hey Jeremy: A great bunch of statistics there. Thanks. Yup, it hurts indeed.

    My guess, though, is a very large number of coaches in those painful close games are BELOW even the .441 you quoted.

    A guess, though.

    Let's get one tonite!!

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    1. I really want an answer to these questions - you've been evading it since I posted, but going back and forth with others:

      Here are 3 questions for you, 453, and Jim (R):

      1) IF Gannon doesn't finish strong, what would you think?
      2) What is the measuring stick of a bad coach in your mind?
      3) What is the measure of a bad season? a good season?

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  53. PS on the Goldcamp senior team: Wasn't Goldcamp out 12 games........and the team went 11-1 without him, the loss on a buzzer-beater by East Stroudsburg??

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  54. Go ahead and look at at stats on the website. I did not see any established coach of successful programs with a lower winning percentage in close games. Certainly not any coach of a school that has regular NCAA success.

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  55. Yup...A major, important part of the season is ahead of us. Those questions need to be addressed at the end of a season, or, the end of a contract.


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